Screenshots...The Good, The Bad and The Ugly

Published on December 29, 2004 By Essencay In OS Customization

"The Good, The Bad and The Ugly"....not talking about screenshots themselves, but just trying to point out up front that this thread could easily go in that direction and I would rather that folks remain civil when posting in this thread about screenshots...Thanks ahead of time

I'm no legal expert....

I am of the opinion that a screenshot is like a photo. Whether it is a picture of your desktop you captured or a picture of a Disney character you took while on vacation, you own the picture, you don't own the content of the picture, if you didn't create it. The artist or copyright holder owns the content of the image. So I believe that you have a responsibility, if you display in public, to present the content in a positive light and if your "picture" doesn't redistribute the artist or copyright holder's original content without consent then it constitutes fair use. How you present that content in your picture is fair game as well, provided that the intent is not to defame or slander the artist or copyright holder. So if I displayed in public a picture I have of let's say Mickey Mouse and alter it so that he's standing there with his knickers around his ankles, then I'd expect that if Disney asked I'd have to remove the picture from the public's view, though Disney can't have the picture because I'm the one who took it with a digital camera then altered it.

I'm not saying that my view is correct, I just posting my viewpoint to get the discussion going so that in the end we all will benefit from having a clearer understanding.

Comments (Page 2)

TheSkinsFactory

on Dec 30, 2004

And RomanDA: ignore comments that are on your skins like i read on iRiver one. Keep up the good work. I'm taking some time off starting now...

ByronTodd

on Dec 30, 2004

Hmmm... I was just doing my duty and reading the comments as you asked on the link that you posted - then giving a "4 month" old WCer's take. I can't take into account what is unknown to me as you so aptly put.

You're right! My three year old nephew is more fun to play with - as is my 15 month old son.

Happy New Year!

TheSkinsFactory

on Dec 30, 2004

heh okay Todd. Happy New Years. and to you RomanDA. Now i really got to go. Cya guys.

BoXXi

on Dec 30, 2004

hehe.... Jeff, you know damn well that I only made that skin to annoy you after you insulted my work. Your e-mails to me bordered on the insane. Anyway, don't worry any more Jeff, because BoXXi, (who you "F-----g Hate!") has already left the building.

P.S. there's a lesson for you to learn amongst all this, if you look for it. Though I doubt your ego will allow you to learn it.

Bye....missing you already....... Love you.

RomanDA

on Dec 30, 2004

TSF,

I will be happy to continue skinning, because if I got that offended that I stopped skinning, I would be the one to loose. I believe that people that slam on others work mainly do so out of some sort of frustration. I make skins and things for me, but granted when someone makes it their mission to slam on your work, it does feel like a personal attack; as I am well aware of. My word of advice is to take the good, ignore the slams, and just do your best. Let the slammers slam, its probably the only joy they get in life. Its only when you sink to their level that they win.

And happy new year to all... How about we all make a resolution to just be nice, and if you cant be nice... um.. Shut the heck up?

As said in one of the funniest (and dumbest) movies ever "Galaxy Quest":

"NEVER GIVE UP...... NEVER SURRENDER!!"

Sleeping Dragon

on Dec 30, 2004

BoXXi and TSF are sittin in a tree, k-i-s-s-i-n-g. Just kidding guys! HAPPY NEW YEAR

Action_Jay

on Dec 30, 2004

This is sad and cute at the same time

I'm not an artist or a skinner myself, though I am a writer and musician. If I saw something created that was a derivative of my work, and done in a way that people would know where the original content came from, I'd be flattered. If I personally felt that it was poorly done and detracted from the original, I'd still be flattered. If I felt that it surpassed the original, I would also be flattered.

Screenshots and photos, however, scan your ass for all I care. There's 'no photography' signs in certain places for several reasons, intellectual property being one of them. As for images that happen across your computer screen, I'd hate to dig through even caring about what gets into screenshots. It's a hard thing to manage or control once your material's out there.

TheSkinsFactory

on Dec 31, 2004

Jeff, you know damn well that I only made that skin to annoy you after you insulted my work.

The insult you mention was me saying your skin was big in a semi-sarcastic way. That was it. You're leaving the building? Seeeee ya.

Z71

on Dec 31, 2004

A while back, Frogboy, did a small article about GUI Champion skins that were over looked. I had a couple skins in there but one made me tilt my head. I saw my "PerPlex" skin was colored green. (The original color is blue). To me, that was like taking the ThunderStorm windowblind and coloring it red and showing everyone what it looked like.

It was no big deal. It did have custom color support. I could have easily emailed him and politely asked to change the color. Which I'm sure he would of done with no problems. He's good like that.

The reason I mention this, is the talk about intellectual propety, my skin wasn't being shown right.

I'm just adding to the thread, trying to shed a little more light on the subject.

I hope I haven't talked out of place or upset anyone.

Frogboy

on Dec 31, 2004

I think it's important to remember that all this is murky from a legal point of view. Anyone who tells ou differently has probably never beein involved in a lawsuit.

That's why the BEST solution is for all parties to try to treat each other with respect. The ability to enforce ones intellectual property rights is depressingly difficult - believe me I know from experience with site flagrantly pirating our stuff or sites using our images and even derivatives of our logo.

So it's not a cut and dry thing. For instance, showing a screenshot of a WindowBlinds skin colorized as a different color would not constitute any sort of violation in my opinion. WindowBlinds is made to colorize skins on the fly and any skin author making skins for it knows this.

Moreover, the example I gave for The Skins Factory has to do with them making a commercial skin which is very different. When financial damage comes into play, things change.

NightTrainthedark

on Dec 31, 2004

When financial damage comes into play, things change.

What if someone values their own emotions and sanity over finances though?

RomanDA

on Dec 31, 2004

Would that be pain and suffering?

Sleeping Dragon

on Dec 31, 2004

I think attornies put a pretty nice price on values, sanity and emotions (pain and suffering)

Essencay

on Dec 31, 2004

Good dialog and Brad nails it with respect for each other in the community.

ByronTodd

on Jan 01, 2005

The analogy that a screenshot is a personal photograph of someone else's art seems to be the most appropriate. It does seem at least reasonable to think that since WC is so big and has such large traffic that the "someone else" might want some control over what they consider to be their art.

Since it is the screenshot section that generates this controversy, I have a suggestion on how both sides of this *debate* could be placated. Why not make the screenshot section only connected to the personal WC pages? In other words, the WC wide library of screenshots goes away, but the ability to upload screenshots does not - at least for those who have setup (and who can setup) personal WC pages. The uploaded screenshots would still be subject to moderation, still available to the public, but not in that way that someone just stumbles upon the particular screenshot. The amount of available space for upload could be determined by WC rank, subscription level or other.

Three things would be afforded by doing this: (1) artists - and the artists representative - can't really object to the screenshots (at least not in the sense of objecting to WC policy), (2) WC is provided some protection - of the legal variety - from copyright infringement claims, and (3) screenshot *spammers* are kept in check.

Just my idea, comments welcomed!

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